Uniting Technology Talent and Compassion to Shape the Next Generation of Veterinary Practice

Well, good evening and welcome to the Veterinary Business Summit on United Technology, talent and Compassion to shape the next generation of veterinary practice. I am Leicester, your host for tonight's webinar. We're thrilled to have you here. Whether you're joining here, whether you're joining us from a busy veterinary practice, an animal health organization, all the comfort from your own home, you're exactly the right place. So this session is all about giving you forward thinking strategies to navigate today's rapidly evolving veterinary landscape, from AI and automation to building resilient financial plans, recruiting and retaining top talent, and creating values driven cultures.

We'll explore the tools and approaches that are shaping the future of veterinary care. So by the end of tonight, you'll walk away with actionable ideas to elevate your team, improve efficiency, strengthen client trust, and lead your practice with confidence in this high demand, high expectation environment.

So before I actually dive in, I would like to intro introduce someone very special, and that is, the founder of, the Veterinary Business Institute. That is Narin Raja Narin is the founder of the Veterinary Business Institute and community, CEO of Eco Marketing, and someone who's spent over 18 years of, helping healthcare practices group. Narin is, Nareen will be joining us in a bit. However, just want to, get everyone, familiar with Nareen. He will be here, in a bit.

And, let's move on with the next, of the agenda. So before we di dive in, I will also like to take a moment to introduce, perhaps or remind you of the Veterinary Business Podcast, which is every Thursday at 5:00 AM Eastern Standard Time. As you can see from this slide, the Veterinary Business Podcast covers a wide range of topics in discussion with industrial leaders, experts, and practice owners. So you can find these podcasts@veterinarybusinessinstitute. com.

I encourage you to, go and have a checkout. It's a great source of best practices, innovative ideas, inspiration, and a great thought leadership as well. So make sure you check out, check, check them out as well. So, thank you again for joining us today, being and being part of the Veterinary Business Institute. this Institute's Annual Leadership and Growth Summit. As you know, our theme this year is uniting technology, talent, and compassion to shape the next generation of veterinary practice.

At this point in this program, we want to pause and really frame why this conversation matters. So, veterinary practice everywhere are balancing innovation with compassion, finding ways to integrate AI automation and smart systems while still protecting the heart of veterinary care. So that's the spirit of, of this summit, bringing together thought leaders who can show us how to future proof our practice while staying true to the purpose that drives this profession. So anyone joining in a huge thank you again.

so here's a quick look of what we have lined up, for this summit. We'll kick things off with Dr. Mendy Hauser, who share insights on the power of culture and what truly sets thriving practices apart. And then we hear, and then we'll hear from Lauren Raja, who will walk us through the veterinary practices, how veterinary practices can stand out and grow in the digital age. And next we have, Dewe Walter Hamilton, who will guide us on preventing conflict before it happens and protecting practices through proactive strategies will then move to Dr.

Mark Zaro, who will highlight how technology and new career paths are shaping the future of veterinary medicine.

And following up, we have, Andrea Crabtree will focus on, people first leadership and how to build, resilient, engaged and thriving veterinary teams. And finally, we'll wrap up with Elm Flowers, who will bring clarity to practice finances in her talk on mastering financial clarity. And of course, at the end we'll open up for an interactive q and a session. of course, if we have time. And of course if there are any questions, please feel free to add them in the chat so you can get those answers during, the discussion as well.

So before we begin, I'd like to introduce myself. My name is Leslie Ez. I manage live events and summits at the veterinary basis in institute, where I focus on create impactful education experiences for veterinary professionals. I also consult independently in the dental and aesthetic industries, helping build strategic partnerships and grow community-driven initiatives. My background is in business and event strategy, and I'm passionate about bringing people together to drive meaningful results.

So lemme take a moment to first introduce our first speaker tonight. That is Dr. Wendy Hauser, the founder of Peak Veterinary Consulting. With more than 30 years of experience as a veterinarian, and hospital owner and industrial leader, Dr. Hauser brings deep expertise in hospital culture, associate development and leadership. She's also a highly respected speaker, author, and consultant who's published over a hundred expert articles and co-authored The Veterinarians Guide to Healthy Pet Plans.

Dr. Hausa, it's a pleasure to have you join us. Welcome to the summit. Thank you, Leicester. It's an honor to be here tonight and I'm looking forward to hearing from everyone on this panel. It's a great lineup. You have.

Thank you, Dr. Hauser. So, our next speaker is,

Debra Voda Hamilton, the principal of Hamilton Law and Mediation. Debra is a pioneer in helping veterinary practices navigate conflicts and compliance through con conscious communication. As both a lawyer and mediator, she has guided countless professionals in resolving disputes, fostering trust, and creating healthier practice environments. She's also help, she's also highly respected author and speaker with her insights featured in outlets like the New York Times, wall Street Journal.

Andres Deb Brides, a pleasure to have you join us. Welcome to the summit. Well, thank you Lester. I echo Wendy's, statement. This is a great panel and I'm looking forward to being on it and hearing what everyone is going to share.

Thank you, Debra. That said, let me also introduce our next speaker. That is Dr. Mark Massaro, the owner of the digital DVM Consulting. Dr. Maro comes from a family of veterinarians and, and has a unique blend of clinical expertise and technology leadership. He has worked across multiple hospitals, advancing innovation in practice management systems and medical software, while also serving as a mentor in veterinary technology education. Dr. Zaro, it's a pleasure to have you with us tonight.

Welcome to the panel.

Thank you. Excited to be here.

Our next speaker is Andrea Crabtree, owner and in consultant at FERPA Consulting. With her extensive background in veterinary practice management and leadership, Andrea has helped countless practices and build strong, resilient teams and improve operations. She's also known for her coaching training, and as co-host of the Positively Leadership Podcast. Andrea, it's a pleasure to have you join us. Welcome to the summit. Thank you so much, Lester. I, I'm excited to be here.

I have my pen and paper here, ready to take down all the great gems I get to hear.

I'm excited. Exactly. So, our final speaker tonight is, Ellen Flowers, the founder of EF advising and bookkeeping for veterinarians. With over 30 years of experience at veterinary care hospital management and financial consulting, and has been a trusted advisor helping veterinary professionals gain control of their business operations while maintaining balance and wellbeing, she brings a wealth of knowledge in guiding practices towards financial clarity and sustainability.

Ellen, it's a pleasure to have you with us. Welcome to the panel. Thank you. I appreciate being here.

So we have a great lineup tonight, and I truly appreciative of each of you taking your time to be here. On your screen, you'll see the main points we'll be covering today. We'll be discussing about, these points. And I'm confident these points will deliver an insightful and valuable discussion. I encourage you to the audience to take notes while listening to this, webinar. It's really important. One thing I often notice, with webinars is that we try to capture everything, but it's more valuable to focus on the key insights that can truly set you up for success.

So, expect actionable tools, relatable scenarios and expert guidance to help you, protect your practice, support your team, and turn complaints into trust building moments. So I also wanna let you know that tonight we also have the chat open. if you like to, pose a question, please go ahead and do that. If you want to react with the heart reaction, a smiley face or a thumbs up, you can go and do that as well. and if for some reason I don't, if some reason you pose a question and I'm not able to get them answered, one of our podcast managers will get those answers from the panelist and, get you those answers in no time.

with that said, I'm, I'm going to stop sharing my screen and I'm going to go to our first segment. in fact, I'm going to share my screen again, because I am going to introduce our first segment. And our first segment is about, power of culture, how it truly sets striving veterinary practices apart. Culture impacts everything from how teams work together to how talent is retained to how clients experience care. And leading us through this important conversation is Dr.

Wendy Hauser, founder of Peak Veterinary Consulting, where spend decades helping practices strengthen both leadership and workplace culture. Dr. Hauser, let's dive into this, session. So, so you've written extensively on hospital culture and leadership. What's one cultural, cultural blind spot many veterinarians practice overlook?

Well, I believe that the culture and the concept of creating, a healthy workplace culture is overwhelming for many leaders if they recognize the value of culture. And that is an, if they may know something is missing, but they may not be able to label it as a healthy workplace culture. They just don't even know where to start. I was in that situation as a practice owner, so I can intensely feel the pain that these owners are going through. now these challenges, I, I've done a lot of research into this area, and these challenges actually occur because workplace co culture is not the starting point.

It's the sum of five underlying components.

so it's not the starting point. It's part of the journey. So the five components that I believe are integral before you can even begin to have a healthy workplace culture are the following. The first is meaningful work. Now, meaningful work occurs when an employee is engaged in work that matters to them, and it makes a difference to others. Their actions have a positive impact. The result is that they feel that they're part of something that's bigger than themselves, the second component.

So that would be the very, very base of building a healthy culture. The next, layer would be purpose. Because purpose helps to guide the daily actions of team members by connecting them to their feelings and their own values so that they can act from the heart. We get up to the middle underlying layer and that shared values. So these are the feelings and the common values that are shared within the team as a whole. They understand the purpose and they can explain it in their own words.

This is a collaborative finding. This is not something that is dictated to them by leadership. And I have worked with many practices that feel that they are driving the values and it really has to represent shared values to build a healthy culture. The fourth layer, as we're getting closer to that cultural, outcome is organizational identity. And that's the role that the practice plays every day. And while it why it's meaningful and valuable to all stakeholders, that's the pets, the clients, the community, the employees, and the veterinary profession as a whole.

Remember, our profession is built upon many healthy practices. We need to be strong individually to stand together united. So, this identity, this, organizational identity actually flows from the shared values. That's why it's important to establish them. And then it forms a common commitment across all team members. And then we're getting up to our very top of the foundational layers, which is organizational purpose. And that identifies the identity of the practice as seen through the eyes of all team members.

Organizational purpose is created when the shared values are visibly linked to business decisions. So one example that I will use is, in my practice one day I just thought, man, there are things I really don't like doing as a veterinarian, and I'm gonna start making a list of the things that I don't like doing. So I made a list and then I talked, and some of them were already on a don't, we don't do list, but I codified this and I went to my team and I said, these are the things that I don't enjoy doing.

What would you add to this list? And then it became a shared and agreed upon document. It became part of the organizational purpose because my team members knew that they were empowered to say, I'm sorry, but we don't do debarking here. we don't do ear crops here. When we got to the point that we didn't do, we did not have a big breeder practice, but we stopped doing puppy, tail docs and removals. 'cause you just can't provide adequate pain control in a neonate.

And it tore my heart out every time I did it. The justification is that my tails looked great. It wasn't a rational justification. So that was just one quick example of what I mean about being tied to business decisions. Potentially you could lose a little bit of money, but you feel good about not making that money.

And once all of these foundational con com components and concepts are in place, then you can begin to work on workplace culture because all of these things feed up into workplace culture.

Amazing, amazing. I think it's a great, reminder and a great way to basically start off this summit. And, so building on that same idea of awareness, let's look at how leaders can move from insight to action. So, Dr. Hauser, how can leaders create an intentional culture that attracts and retains top talent in such a competitive market? Well, Lester, we just talked about some ways, right? Creating all of these supporting structures for a healthy culture.

I do believe that the most overlooked aspect in workplaces today is employee engagement. We're not talking about it. Other industries are. And I will say that Zoetis is beginning a collaborative effort to measure work, employee engagement, which is very much needed in the veterinary profession. So employee engagement is a team member's commitment to their work, to their team, and to the practice. And when engagement's, high practices have a lower absentee rate, they have lower turnover, they have increases in patient safety.

This is measurable and proven in human practice. They also have, increases in client loyalty and they're more profitable. So according to the most, Gallup does huge studies on this, and they actually have an assessment tool, the practices can use themselves. And so, when you take a look at the Gallup, research, they looked at over 2.5 million workers worldwide, 19,000 plus in the US across a bunch of different organizations. And they found that only 32% of employees are engaged in the work that they do.

You have 10 employees in your workplace, three of 'em are contributing productively, the other seven are not.

So that means that 68% of the employees, the other seven, are emotionally detached. They're disengaged at work, they're putting time but not passion into their work. And even worse, 17% of that 68% are actively disengaged. That means that they're not just unhappy at work, they're resentful, and they are allowed about their resentment. So their needs are not being met and they're gonna act out their unhappiness. So those become, you can see how it's hard to have a healthy workplace culture without engagement.

They really go hand in hand because those actively disengaged employees are going to, be pulling, they're rowing in the wrong direction. They're gonna be trying to create a disengaged, workforce and a toxic culture. So the interesting thing is that disengagement actually arrives from neglected elements in the workplace. And if you go to the Gallup research, you're gonna find there's about 12 to 15 driving factors that, that contribute to disengagement.

So that means the good news is that leaders have the power to flip that script and they can redesign work that provides employees with a, a sense of having control over their work. They have autonomy, they have choices and work that aligns with their personal sense of meaning and purpose.

Amazing, amazing, insightful. And, I think it's excellent. You, you basically went and broke that down very in a very understandable, way. So it's clear that intentional consult isn't just a buzzword, it's really a competitive advantage that a lot of practices are using it. So let's broaden the lens a bit. And you've seen veterinary practices from multiple angles, clinical industry and consulting. So you worked across clinical practice practices, industry and consulting.

What common threads have you seen practices that thrive long term

Lester? One of the most common threads that I see in successful organizations are strong leaders.

Effective leaders know how to modify their leadership style to the needs of their followers in that moment. So if we go to Goldman's six styles of leadership, it's important to know when to use each style or to even if to use them. So for instance, pace setting can be a very demoralizing style for all, but the most competent, highly trained, confident employee. So that's one that would probably almost never be pulled out of my toolbox.

So if I wanted to introduce a new initiative, I may want to use the leadership style of affiliative or Democratic. and that's where team members and perspectives are elicited. They're actively heard, they're reinforced, and they're incorporated into problem solving. Talk about feeling that you're part of the solution. Now, in an emergency situation, and I've been in this situation many times as have, I'm sure Dr. ERO as well. There are times that you do have to be very co coercive or directive.

You have a crisis come in, you have an animal that is, circling the drain, and you have to lead your team in a very directive manner for the benefit of the animal, but also for the benefit of the team. You need to lead and inspire confidence. Now, these really strong leaders also understand the impact of their words and actions on their followers. They avoid co causing stress and anxiety by being very intentional to avoid negative language. And I bet we're gonna hear more about that from Deb Hamilton tonight.

and they also, use, they communicate clearly. They model emotional self-regulation, and they're appropriately optimistic. We know that leaders can't always be optimistic because that would risk being inauthentic, but when possible be optimistic. And finally, they acknowledge and actively manage their, the emotions that are present in the workplace. They welcome emotions in and they work to shape them to the benefit of all. And then finally, these leaders create environments where the followers do have autonomy.

I've used that word a lot tonight. It is so critical. and this is something that we don't do well in a lot of veterinary practices, and we need to empower our employees to succeed. So in part, this is accomplished by tailoring work to their strengths and to the interests of each employee, rather than this all encompassing cookie cutter job description that says, you will do everything on here. Like, who cares if everyone does everything as long as the sum total is that the work is getting done.

So, and we don't have time, but I could go into another example on that one. So being a good leader is work, and all leaders make mistakes. It's important to learn from the mistakes, to be a lifelong learner, to have self-awareness, self-regulation, and to be adaptable.

Exactly. Fantastic perspective. But before we actually end the segment, I would like to have, there's a question from the audience from Joy Furman. Thank you Joy for joining us tonight. how can you go about getting input from the team about the practice culture? Yes, joy, thank you. And Joy is a friend. So how nice to hear from Joy today. She's well known to many of us on this call. and so, joy, the way that I like to do this, and actually I have one going on right now, is, is a culture audit.

I have a, well, right now it's out to 275 employees because it's a subset of the entire organization. So, I've asked them to do a cultural audit so I can get a good handle. This organization knows they've had a lot of changes and a lot of disruption. So in this culture audit, I'm gonna ask questions like, what are the three words that you're gonna use to describe the personality of your practice that lets you put a finger on the pulse of what's going on in the practice.

do you have a healthy culture? Is it neglected? Is it toxic? so that's the first thing I'm gonna do. And also from there, you can begin to get an idea about shared values. So if you have a word, one of the core values that my team chose as a hospital owner was friendly. That was their shared value. And I'll tell you, the hospital, we did this culture audit and the manager and I stepped outta the room and let them choose the words they thought fit.

Now, I had looked at the words I was comfortable with by the vast majority of them, but when we went through, I could see friendly was in almost every single culture response. So you'll see some overwhelming responses that begin to tell you that is a shared value. So, the shared values exercise actually arises out of the culture audit. Then you ask other questions, you know, what is most rewarding to you at work? what, what makes you feel good? Can you tell me about a time that you felt really good at work?

How do you like to relax when it's your time off? And all of these things help you to get an idea about the shared culture. and that is present in the practice. So that's the first place I start with my clients, with my own teams. and then we build up with many act or I should say, we build out with many other activities.

Amazing, amazing. So, Dr. It's been, it's been a pleasure hearing your perspective. thank you for sharing such practical and thoughtful provoking insights to kick us off this summit. And, yeah, so we'll be moving into the next segment, which is basically about, digital visibility. But before that, I like to introduce, Noreen Raja, who is just, who has just joined us. so Noreen will be basically, giving, talking about the next part of the, segment.

so let me basically share my screen.

so,

so yeah. So Noreen, welcome to the panel. And, Naureen is basically the founder of the Veterinary Business Institute and community and CEO of e co-marketing, and someone who spent over 18 years helping healthcare practices grow. So Nen, thank you for joining us. And please, if you can share some words before we begin. Yeah, thank you everyone. I wanna take a minute to thank all the panelists, all the attendees live, and of course the, the many members we have in this group.

So, really appreciate all of you for your support. We couldn't have done what we are doing without you. you know, we have been doing this for a couple of years now, and as many of you know, we have a podcast. we also do events, pretty much every month. And, many of, the panelists here have contributed to, to with us in the past. So appreciate you for that, and hopefully we'll see more of you. I think, there's always a lot of knowledge and information being shared, so I appreciate the opportunity to share my thoughts on, some of the questions we keep getting all the time about marketing and so forth today.

Thank you. No, so, so up next, actually, we are going to dive into a topic that that's on every practices, practice owner's mind. So how to stand out and grow today's digital first world from profitability challenges to competing with large corporate groups. This segment will walk us through what prac, private practice owners can do to thrive in the digital age. And there's no better person to lead us into this is than now in our Raja of eco marketing and the founder of Veterinary Business Institute.

So now in, let's dive in. many, many veterinary practices are struggling, especially over the last few years in maintaining and growing profitability. You and your team do a lot of research. What are you finding? thank you so much. I think, COVID was a blessing, for many veterinary practice owners because it was a time when, you know, people couldn't move right? In many, many states, they couldn't literally get out of the house. And, one of the things that we saw, not just during COVID, but the subsequent months before the vaccine was developed, and people really had to watch where they're going and who they're spending time with, is everyone who never had a pet decided to have a pet.

I've seen this even in my community. So all of a sudden, you know, that became the thing. And the other thing that happened is they couldn't go out to restaurants. They couldn't go out to many, many businesses they would otherwise go and spend money in. So a lot of that money went into veterinary profession kind of very uniquely. So what that did is it created an environment where anyone could succeed, meaning any practice owner could succeed, you just were overwhelmed with work.

And because, partly because all the money was going into, you know, pets. So a lot of the money was going into pets. And also because more people want, you know, were owning pets. I remember a time when, you know, just to get a pet, you would spend like four, $5,000 and, you know, so such a hard, you know, thing to even get a new pet. So, so that happened. So as, as part of that, I think it's kind of like, everyone succeeded. So not only like people forgot, or at least forgot some of the fundamentals that made them successful prior to that.

So now that we are coming out of the pandemic, and it has been five years, more than five years since the pandemic, now things are back to normal. People are going out, people are going on vacations, they're spending their money in many, many, many different ways. So what we are noticing is, and the other thing that happened is, this has been a trend that has been going on for a long time. Corporations came into this whole, private equity, as you might, the buzzword is, came into this whole space.

And the way they worked is they borrowed money for pretty much zero interest rate. For the longest time, interest rates were very low. So they, they could get money for pretty much for nothing. And they used that to and buy a practices, you know, in, in a large volume. But then also over the last three, four years, as many of us know, interest rates have gone up. So all of a sudden those private equity practices, are in trouble because all their math is now broken.

Nobody's willing to pay them more than what they paid for. And it's not just in veterinary private equity, but all private equi equity businesses or most of them are in trouble. So that's the good news. So right now, I do think, there's a huge advantage for smart veterinary practice owners to really stand out and, and do well. So I guess the, the difference between those who are succeeding today, I'm talking about private practice owners, and those who are not, is those who are not, never really sharpened their marketing engine, never really built a marketing engine.

So they ended up with, you know, emergency clients. In other words, they'll bring a pet when there's a problem. And those clients usually are not very loyal. They don't come back, they don't, they're very disruptive to the practice because they just show up and yell and scream and then whatever, when their needs are met, they never come back again. So it's not very healthy way to run a practice, right? As opposed to a pet owner who appreciates, health of their pet and is willing to care for it, right?

From day one. And throughout the life of that pet will listen to you, will, will come back and, you know, take, take your recommendations and do what needs to be done. And that's a very profitable and enjoyable part of your practice. So, so what our research is showing is that if you can lean into attracting those, you know, owners or, you know, pet parents who, who are looking for, you know, holistic or comp comprehensive healthcare for their pets, I think you're gonna be better off versus just catering to people who just come and there's a problem.

so I do think there's a lot of opportunity here. And also the fact that the PE business has been broken because of high interest rates, I think is the other, other, other opportunity here. Many of them are underwater, like they can't even, you know, raise value. You know, the valuation is less than what it used to be, when money was free because, you know, they paid crazy multiples and so forth. So those all, I think good things, if you know how to tap into it, at least that's what we are finding Amazing findings.

Thanks now. And so, that really highlights how real these challenges are and why practices need to take the proactive approach instead of waiting for the market to shift. So with that said, why don't the big corporate group practices focus on marketing in the right way? Can you explain how this is a benefit for private practice owners? Yeah, so I'll just, I mean, many of you may or may not know this about PE backed practices. I mean, it's a money arbitrage game, right?

So there are whole idea is that if you are an individual practice, you might be worth five times profit. But when you're part of a group, you are worth 20 times profit. So they don't have to do anything other than put the group together. And when money was free, they couldn't buy these practices at very cheap loans. Now, all of that is outta the water, which means that multiple is also a come down significantly, because when money is expensive, nobody's gonna give you 20 times profits.

They are saying, no, I'm not gonna do that because I can, you know, put my money in the bond market and get pretty recent return returns or even, you know, buy a mortgage and get pretty decent returns with very little or zero risk. Why would I invest in a business and pay this kind of a multiple that only tech companies or those kind of companies demand? So they, they, they have their back against the wall. Now, having said that, there are a lot of successful practices in veterinary medicine and in know, in, in, in, in parts of medicine like dentistry and, and so forth.

And I think the ones who are successful, whether they are in dentistry or whether in veterinary medicine, the private practice owners, they really have really thought about their ideal customer. They really have thought about who that is, how to attract them, how to keep them, and then of course, how to keep them coming back. Because if you attract your ideal customer, like we talked about, the customer who, who's willing to spend money on the health of their pet, who's taking a long-term approach, not I go to the vet when there's a problem approach to care.

You know, they, those clients are worth, you know, five times or four times as much as those who come to you for, you know, emergency only care, right? So are you attracting those clients? Are you, 'cause a lot of these clients are driven by knowledge and education. Are you educating them? Are you, helping those kind of clients, find you when they're looking for things, right? Not just, Hey, I have a problem and can I bring my pet right now at 7:00 PM but rather, like, who are looking to like, you know, learn about, you know, for example, you know, my, you know, I have a pet who's almost 13 years old now, and we knew right from the start, there are certain diseases this particular breed would be prone to.

So we, we started researching it, we started talking to a ve about it, and we did certain things to help mitigate some of the challenges we would face later on. Now that's a different kind of a client who, who's educated, the same person who, who's reading up information about their own health and trying to get their own health under control versus just waiting for a heart attack and then go to the emergency room, right? That the same kind of a mindset. And I think there's a lot more people who are interested in their own health or their pet's health today than there were pre COVID.

I think COVID really made everyone take health and their own health seriously, and their own family's health and their own pet's health seriously. So I think there's a huge opportunity to go after them and help, help them, you know, find you, like, for example, they are the ones who are looking for very specific, you know, topics like a particular breed or, you know, issues related with a particular breed or even looking for a, you know, a, a really, a veterinarian who specializes in, you know, small animals and who has amazing reviews.

So for example, even something as basic as veterinarian near me, are you ranking for those keywords? Veterinarian clinic in my city? Are you showing up? Like, I'm not talking about through ads, I'm talking about organically. So 95% of these, these clients go to Google to learn about things, to find out what their options are in their local community, and they, start typing these keywords. Are you showing up? And if you are showing up, then, you know, not just for one or two keywords, but for hundreds of them.

So whatever they type in related to their pet, you should be the only veterinarian who keeps showing up again and again and again. And there's a way to do that. And I'll get into that, you know, later on in my presentation. You would have a really unfair advantage if you're able to do that.

Great points, great points. So now, what are the few things that a private vet practice owner focuses on? How on to have the right kind of marketing that you just talked about? Yeah. a well-designed website to me, a well-designed website is not something that just the owner likes, but something that works for the parent. In other words, I'm researching a topic, I should a, see your website, which is my second point. You should rank for at least a hundred or more keywords and phrases on page one of Google or top three results.

Meaning if I type in veterinary near me or veterinary and, you know, small animal veterinarian or, you know, cat veterinarian or a dog veterinarian, because that's how they're thinking, right? My, my pet is, or a certain breed veterinarian. Are you showing up if you, if I type in certain medical conditions because I keep learning about it from the, the breeder who I bought the pet from or through my own research? Are you showing up? So, so have a website that actually shows up not just for one or two keywords or phrases, but all the keywords and phrases at the top of Google, which is the second thing.

And the third thing is to achieve that, you need to focus on things like nap. In other words, Google makes so much money from Google ads, and so does social media companies like Instagram and Facebook, they make like hundreds of billions of dollars, so they don't want to give you any free traffic. So getting free traffic from Google is, is hard. Like 5% of you will get 95% of the free traffic, therefore the 95% has to give Google tons of money to get paid traffic.

Now, the problem with paid traffic is if I love my pet, I don't want to go to somebody who's advertising because in my mind, they're not good. That's why they're advertising, right? If they were good, why would they be advertising? That's the way we think. So you wanna make sure that, you, you, you need to understand that if, if you are relying on ads, you're gonna be spending five to 10 times as much and you're gonna get a lot of no-show. So my option would be organic, SEO or organic social media.

Now, social media is not easy unless you are somebody who's a content creator who loves doing that. So my recommendation is lean into something like SEO, which is all about you showing up for hundreds of different keywords, and then when people keep doing their own research and trying to make a good decision for their pet and their family, you are the one that kind of jumps out in their mind. of course, there are lots of other technical details like original content, you know, how many reviews are you getting?

Like we recommend you get at least 10 or more reviews every month. how many qual how, how many quality backlinks you have. So these are all the things Google is looking at nap, original content backlinks to really decide who's going to be in the 5% and who's not gonna be in the 5%. It's almost like getting into a top university. To get into the top university, you have to have excellent, you know, entrance exam scores. You have to have excellent GPA, excellent recommendations, excellent extracurriculars, right?

You have to do well in everything. Same thing. If you wanna be in that 5% who's getting all this traffic for free, you know, 95% of the traffic for free, where people are looking for these types of things, you need to be really good at n original content backlinks, Google reviews, you know, and, now something called CR ux, that's Chrome ux, that's like, it used to be Google Lighthouse Code, but now it has been replaced. I don't wanna get into the technical details.

If anyone is curious how well you are doing in attracting patients, attracting, you know, the type of patients you want, your ideal patients, you know, I would recommend, you know, book a meeting with us and I can talk more about it later on. But just so that you get a report card on how well you're doing, and once you get a report card, then you can like figure out, okay, what do I need to do to create an unfair advantage? So the right kind of patients are finding me versus I'm just in under it with emergency only patients.

Exactly. So, so you talked about a marketing strategy. Can you discuss a bit more about what constitutes a marketing strategy and what doesn't? Yeah, absolutely. and I also touched on, you know, yes, you can run ads, but they're five to six times more expensive because of trust, right? In other words, you need five to six times the traffic to get trust. So to me, ads is not a marketing strategy. That's a marketing tactic. You know, it's kind of like you throw six times as much money for some short term benefit, but then the problem is those people won't show up.

So you have to literally like kiss a lot of frogs to even get one or two good clients, because, you know, they will, they don't even remember booking an appointment because they just saw the ad and they saw something they didn't like, and they're like, oh, I'm not sure. I don't want to, you know, I don't be, I can't be bothered. So I, so ads is not a, not a, not a strategy, it's a tactic. you know, some people do promotion. So before I talk about a strategy, I'll tell you what is not a strategy.

They're like, okay, $50 this, or free this, or free that. They'll try to give a discount. I'm sure we all know Groupon, right? Groupon itself is out of business because there used to be a time where people thought, if you can get somebody, it doesn't matter how they come in, they're good clients. They're not. If somebody comes in with a Groupon for free something or a half price something, once they get the free something or half price something, they're never coming back.

Same thing with promotions. If you're attracting clients because of some deal, they're not coming back, 80% of them are not coming back. So these are the things not to do ads and, you know, and things like Groupon. So I think you have to show up organically. That means they, when they are doing research, you need to be the one they hear about. And like I said, one is you create so much content on social media, or you rank for hundreds of keywords or whatever they type in, you show up naturally at the top of Google results.

so I think a good strategy would have a few components. One is like you would, you know, rank for hundreds of keywords. Two, you would, you know, get 10 or more Google reviews every month because people also will check out your reviews, because, you know, just because you are showing up again and again and they find you, doesn't mean they're gonna call your office. They're going to go to Google and, you know, type your business name. Look at your reviews. If you're getting 10 or more reviews every month, now again, you get into that special camp where you have unfair advantages and more likely for the person to choose you versus your competition.

You'll have a website that's easy to use, meaning whether it's a mobile device or a desktop, whatever, they're looking for a particular topic immediately, they can go to their website. That website will load fast, that will, you know, give them the right information. However, easy call in phone number so that they don't have to go hunt for the number. They can just press a button and, you know, call the number. Keep in mind, two thirds of people today use a mobile device to find you.

So it has to be optimized for mobile. again, other strategies, I don't think work anymore is billboards or flyers. Why? Because I see the flyer all the time. I mean, most people when, when they get in a flyer, they don't even look at it. Like in my case, I haven't seen a flyer for ages, because literally we have a, a thing that says no unsolicited mail in our mailbox. Our mailman knows he shouldn't be putting anything unsolicited because we'll throw it in the garbage and we'll get upset with him because we literally put that note there, right?

So, so we don't get any junk mail, we don't get any flies, and that's most people, right? If you need something, we'll go find it through Google or other tools, but we are not gonna sit there, sit and waste our times going through flies. So don't waste your money on things like that. Those are like, makes you feel good, and maybe somebody's trying to sell you something, even like magazines, right? Because how many times sit and go through that magazine when we are thinking about our pet?

Very rarely. So, you know, people are only switching vet, you know, at any given time. Only 3% of the people, the other 97% are happy with their vet. So, so instead of wasting your time targeting the other 97% with, you know, you know, flyers and billboards and radio or tv, all these traditional kind of marketing, help them find you when they're looking for things. And that's where I think, you know, SEO might be one of the better options. now word of mouth used to be great, but it doesn't work anymore because today we don't ask people, we don't ask our friends, we just Google it.

We just get our own information. Even when a friend recommends a great restaurant, we still Google it and look at, you know, the reviews and look at the menu and look at the, the dishes and look at the ambience, right? We don't wanna trust anybody today. We just wanna make our own minds. And Google kind of gives us the information to make our own minds. So I think like, you have to really understand how do I show up, consistently? How do I influence people?

And I think Google reviews is a huge part, and then just do those things, right? And again, I target the right keywords, right? If, if you don't want emergency patients, don't target that keyword. If you want those patients who care about, you know, the entire life cycle of their pet and the healthy life of their pet, like literally, I have a friend who lives in, in Vancouver, you know, they don't have any kids for him. His pet is a, you know, his, his kid.

I mean, literally they go to a chiropractor. I mean, he's of course on the extreme end where they would do anything for their pet. But there are more and more people who, who care about their pet and who really wanna take care of their pet in a healthy way. They don't, I have another friend, you know, you know, like, like they don't go on vacations. The pet is old and you know, the pet, you know, is, you know, they don't wanna leave the pet with anybody, right?

I mean, people take their pets very seriously. And I think there are, you know, tens of millions, if not hundreds of millions of, you know, pet owners like that. So you should go after them versus the ones who don't. And, you know, so, so that's kind of my strategy. Like, you know, understand who you wanna attract and then do the things that those people are looking for. And like I said, easy to use website, great Google reviews, you know, ranking for hundreds or more keywords.

Those are in the fundamentals. All the other stuff like ads and, you know, billboards and flyers, they're not, they're tactics. And in my experience, they don't work.

Thank you, Noreen. And that really clears up the difference between chasing tactics and actually have a real strategy. So, Noreen, would you like to, reflect back on how to basically book the strategy meeting? Yeah, absolutely. So I think, you know, whether you work with, you know, Equa marketing, the company I founded or not, I recommend you need to figure out how you are doing with regards to marketing and how you are doing with regards to positioning your practice.

So get a audit, get a review. So we offer it at no cost, veterinary business institute. com/m msm, we'll tell you how you are doing in terms of Google reviews, how you are doing in terms of a CEO, how is your competition doing? You know, what are the do's and the don'ts all, what are the things you're doing right? And what are the things you're doing wrong? So we'll give you a report card that looks at all the keys to success, including all the six keys to SEO success.

And then we'll tell you what you need to do to get into that 5% bucket. In any, any, any, any part of your business or any part of life, there are those 5% who do so much better than the 95%, and they learn, they know a few secrets, and they know how to, succeed by mastering those secrets. So, you know, you need to master the secrets of how do I attract 95% of the free traffic? How do I, you know, stand out and then just keep doing it. Once you know what the secrets are, then you just have to make it part of your routine.

Make it part of your, you know, cadence. So you continue to get better and better on those areas. And you don't just stay in the top 5%, you get into the top three, top one, percent and so forth. So it, it can become a fun journey where people are coming to you. You don't have to go find them, you only roll, then turns into like providing great care, and then of course asking for Google reviews. So those are the two things you have to do, just making sure you're providing great care, because nobody's gonna write wonderful reviews if you don't provide great care.

And then asking for that, asking for it because, you know, people are busy. So, go to the link veterinary business institute. com/msm. we would love to help. And, you know, we'll help you, you know, at least understand where you are and what you need to do. Thank you, no, for sharing your thoughts in this segment. Like, like you said, you, you can, also book the session where the QR code on screen, you can scan that. And, and since these calls are personalized, available is very limited.

So, so I encourage you to grab your spot before it fills up. So with that said, I'm moving on to the next segment. but diving into a topic that every veterinary practice faces at some point, which is conflict. So whether it's between staff and clients or within the team itself, how those moments are handled can shape both the patient experience and the culture of the practice. And there's no one better to guide us through this than Debra. We Hamilton Prime principal at him, Hamilton Law and Mediation, Debra specializes in helping veterinary practices navigate disputes with conscious communication and proactive strategies.

Debra, let's get into the, to the discussion. So conflict between veterinary teams and clients can escalate quickly. What strategies do you recommend for diffusing high stress situations in real time? I think you're muted, Debra Lester. Thanks for that question. And if we start off with the understanding that behind every heated moment is someone who loves their pet and a veterinarian who is dedicated to caring for the pet, we can diffuse the conflict that might arise.

I call this the pause and pivot, because if you pause and you breathe and you remember that everybody's here for the benefit of the pet, then you can diffuse a conflict by not being reactive and defensive just to breathe. Just take a minute, acknowledge that emotion is something, you know, that happens to everyone. And maybe you can start by saying something like, I can see how much you care about Fluffy. And this enables everyone to pivot to that shared goal, which is fluffy.

You know, we sometimes lose our ability to recognize either a veterinarian or a client that we're, we all came into the office today to see what's wrong with Fluffy, or to take really good care of Fluffy, because we've either had a bad day or the last client wasn't very respectful. And so I'm taking that bias into the room, or for the client, they had a bad day at work, and whatever you said is gonna trigger them. So just remember that, you know, if you pause and pivot, you're going to be able to diffuse, a conflict to that might arise.

using the pet as the common ground when tensions arise, brings the focus back to why you're there, which is the animal's wellbeing. it's, it's interesting if you can train your team to pause and pivot to, and to listen first, because sometimes they hear something and it triggers them. And if you can teach your team, a, a lot of what Wendy had said goes along with this, if you teach your team to listen, and maybe if they have a question, they can validate what they're feeling by asking sort of a curious question.

So, Mrs. Hamilton, tell me a little bit more about why, you're here today with Fluffy and, and why you're, why you're having such a, a reaction. Because you want to be able to respect and, and appreciate how someone's feeling, and they're very worried about their pets. making sure that you are working together with the client, not that you, I have to say that taking the pet in the back is probably one of the best ways to create conflict in your practice.

I know since COID and Nore spoke about that, that a lot of vets take the pet in the back and the client just sits there in the examination room. And that can really lead to a lot of conflict because the client really feels left out of the conversation. Transparency is very weak. There's no communication about what happened in the back. And if the pet comes back and it's shivering or something, you know, the client's gonna tell themself a story. The veterinarian or the vet tech is gonna be in the middle of that story.

And so being able to be transparent and have communication, is the most important piece. Sometimes the most powerful phrase you can use is simply to say, help me understand what would feel right to you when you're having an examination of a pet? Will it feel right for me to take it than back? 'cause some clients would rather have the dog or cat taken in the back 'cause they, they can't see their dog or cat, you know, wiggle. and so you're asking them for input.

You're asking them for a collaborative decision. this is part of what I have found in my practice because I'm sort of a unicorn. I take care of clients, disagreements with veterinarians and veterinarians, disagreements with staff and clients. So I try to keep everyone in a place where they are actively listening, where they are not presuming, and where they really, consider what is important to the client about that pet and also what's happening in their practice.

No one should be mistreated by anyone, be it a staff member, a veterinarian, or a client. So we have to make sure that when we pause and pivot, we recognize that, take a step back, actively listen, ask curious questions, and you are the person, the worried pet parent needs in that moment. So recognize that and move forward. Exactly. Thank you, Deborah. This is a practical perspective, and having those realtime strategies, can make the difference between escalation and resolution.

So let's talk about prevention. How can practices foster a culture of transparent communication that prevents disputes before they start? Well, Wendy covered a number of those aspects in her discussion, but for me, I always like to let practices start with why they're there. Why are you here? Why? You know, it probably goes along with the culture audit that, Wendy talked about, but I would expand the culture audit to take in clients, because if you only take a culture audit in the four walls, you're missing one incredibly important perspective.

And so if you don't know how clients see your practice, then you're gonna miss the ability to foster that culture of transparency, and communication because it, it really is about all of you. You're a working team. And if a client doesn't feel agency, if a vet tech doesn't feel agency, if, an associate veterinarian doesn't have agency, then that communication is going to break down. I, I just wanted to comment a moment because it's, it was important, what Noreen said, about getting out there and, and getting Google, reviews.

But I have found in, in my practice that the best way to really create, a collaborative relationship for your veterinary practice is to be community minded, is to get out there and do something with the community. If it's the, the Girl Scouts, the Boy Scouts, whatever, it's, you know, the community farmer's market whatever. I know you all have a lot of time that you take to work and there's not a lot of time on the other side. However, this is seeing you in a community light.

And so they're gonna say, wow, Dr. Houser was here for our, you know, check the pet or whatever. It's just something to do at the, local farmer's market once a month maybe. And that creates that know, like, and trust, which is, I think, part of what Wendy was talking about. And I always talk about, because when you're having a conversation with a client, no, liking and trusting is going to make your, relationship so much better. I also, want to talk about making sure if you are, you know, having sort of communication issues, check your assumptions.

Because what we do is we walk into a client and I remember, you know, identifying myself at a breeder at a vet conference and everybody just said, oh God. And that's a bias, you're bringing into the room and you don't even know me. So when you, and even if you've seen this person before and they were not necessarily friendly last time, don't take that in with you this time because that way you can make sure that your communication will always start on a positive note. Hi Mrs. Hamilton, how are you?

We're so glad you and fluffy your back again. and if you're actually wanting to have a conversation and you, you want to include the client, which I highly recommend, make sure that you ask questions like, here's what I'm thinking and why.

What are your thoughts? Because they don't know a lot, but they want to hear what you have to say and they wanna be part of the decision making. And if in fact they come back with some novel thoughts and ideas, they might be pie in the sky, they might be crazy, but you know what? Sometimes they will really truly work. I just had a client who came in, and had, a discussion with a veterinarian who dismissed their approach. And it turned out when she went to the emergency vet that that was the approach the emergency vet took.

So sometimes you'll learn things from your clients about their pets. 'cause they might not know veterinary medicine. Absolutely no way. That's why the vets are there, but they do know their pet and this is a collaborative relationship. So you need to get that information out of the clients so you can effectively treat the pets.

Excellent, excellent. I think it's also like what you meant. Building a culture of openness and transparency truly to stage Vulnerability Lester, because you, you really want to show your vulnerability so that your clients feel safe with you. If you come in and just boom, boom, boom. It might give them a sense of, well, this person knows what they're doing. However, it also might give them a sense of, well, I can't really speak up and tell them what I think 'cause they're sort of just moving on.

So there's a delicate bound there about being the person with all the information in the room and the person who might need more information that they have to get from the client. Exactly. Exactly. Now talking about legal compliance, so legal compliance can feel overwhelming, what are the most common mistakes you see practices making and how can they correct them? Well, I think the biggest mistake is that, you know, as a lawyer, we always want you to keep your records.

and there are many ways to keep records now, especially with ai, and be careful because AI is only as good as the person who's reading it and making sure it's reflecting what you're saying and what you're doing. I always say that treating compliance as separate from good medicine and client care would be a mistake because all three of them will lead to making good records. Because, you know, documentation has to include how you spoke to the client, what you told the client, what you observed in the animal, and then checking in with the client to see if they actually understood what you said.

There's nothing wrong with saying, you know, this is what I'm thinking we can do, and do you feel comfortable doing that at home? do you feel comfortable giving medication? Do you give comfortable, do you feel comfortable keeping the dog crate because it hurt itself? These are things, that you have to, to establish with your client and then put in your records so that you know that you did tell them to put the dog in a crate after a cruciate surgery, and they didn't do it and they're complaining that you never told them.

And I always tell my veterinarians, please don't say, but I told you what, it's right here in my notes. That will create such conflict. What you wanna say is, you know, I'm pretty sure that we talked about this. Why don't we go back to the notes I sent home with you just to see what we said, to see if I said it in a way that maybe wasn't clear enough. Don't be condescending, but be curious about whether or not you forgot it and it wasn't in their notes going home.

because we all make mistakes. Everybody makes mistakes. And you know what, clients never, in my experience, I can tell you this, never sue anyone who says, oh my God, I made a mistake. I need to, I mean, you know, it's, it's how you respond. Whether or not they're going to, you know, go to the licensing bureau or you know, have your records, you know, read by someone who's supposedly an expert who's gonna say, you didn't do a good job.

You just need to make sure. Yvette at Cornell when I was speaking said to me, you know, one of my professors told me that if they're your friend and they know, like, and trust you, if you forget to write something down or you forget to tell them something and it's like, oh shoot, I should have told you, it just slipped my mind. They're gonna say, you know, that happens to me too. You know, we all forget things and it's not intentional. I always tell the clients and the veterinarians that nobody came into this office, into this examination room wanting to have a fight.

Not one. It just is how I hear what you say, you hear what I say. And if we're having a bad day, that can really escalate and that can actually go into your paperwork. And I'm gonna caution you, even if you have code, do not put in that Mrs. Hamilton is a pain in the butt in your records. Really not good. Even if you have a code, not good, you should really make sure that you keep it professional, you make it as clear as possible, and make sure that you check in with your client when you're giving them documentation to take home that they understand what they're supposed to do.

I've had so many people say, well, they never told me to keep 'em crated after appreciate surgery, and I know the vet did because that's sort of like given, but you really need to make sure they understand that that's a long period of time and the dog's not gonna be happy and I empathize with you, but this is what we need to do to keep the dog safe.

Amazing, amazing, incredible, valuable points. And it's also an important reminder that often those overlook details can actually create the biggest risks. So, we do have, before I actually move on to the next, next segment, I do have a question from Joy. Thank you for Joy. Thank you Joy again for posing this question. So in today's economic, economic clients often do not value or appre appreciate how expensive it is to provide veterinary care. What do you say to the client that becomes escalated because of the cost of the care?

Well, that's a great question, joy. And it usually comes with a lack of transparency and pre-paving. If you are able to create some pre-paving before they even walk in the door, this is what we're hoping to do with Fluffy. This is our, our costs. Let us know if we can help you. Let us know if there's a way to work with you. if it's an emergency, they simply want to know what the cost is. And you're absolutely right when you have a client who gets angry because there's just so much and they can't see their way clear, recognize that, you know, have your practice do as much creative, financial, discovery as they can so they can offer it to a client various ways to pay either, on credit cards or by payment.

But when they get escalated, I always say, you know, I get it, it is expensive and believe me, we are doing the best we can to keep our expenses, you know, in line. And we'd really like to hear some more about what you think we could do differently to make this as,

impactful for your pet experience and for you. and also be able to keep the top staff that we have, and be able to have the equipment we have to help your cli your, your pet right here in our practice. It's that veterinarians don't preppa. And I love them very much. And I say this with all love and affection. They don't pre-PA a client understanding what it costs to open the doors. And I'm not saying open your books and tell them what you charge, but make sure they know we have a state of the art this.

Make sure they know that you know, you are there, to be able to help them. and you have, you know, top vet techs and this is the kind of practice where we value input. Tell us about the price. If you ask 'em about the price, they're not gonna b***h about the price. I hate to say that, but they are it because if you tell them upfront, then they know what they're gonna do. It's when it comes afterwards that they sometimes, have a little pushback because they're sort of in for a penny in for a pound or, oh my God, I can't do this.

So it's, it's something that should be more transparent. and if we were really doing our jobs well as clients and as, veterinarians, we would ask more curious questions about what it is you can afford. I hope that answers your question, joy.

Exactly. So Debra, thank you for sharing such actionable and insightful guidance. Conflict prevention and com compliance can feel intimidating, but you've shown us how practical strategies and clear communication can take all, can make all the difference. It's been a pleasure having you with us today. So moving on, we are moving into an exciting segment and that is basically how technology can create, how technology and new career paths parts

are shaping the future of veterinary medicine. And that's, Dr. Mark Massaro has been at the intersection of clinical practice and technology for years, and he brings a unique perspective on where this profession is headed. Let's dive in. So, so Dr. Massaro, you worked with the intersection of clinical practice and technology. How do you see the software transforming the way veterinarians still work here in the next decade?

Yeah, so I love that Deborah brought up AI already. 'cause that is the, the biggest buzz word of the moment when it comes to veterinary technology, veterinary software. Everybody is, is talking about ai. And if you, if you haven't heard or seen about all these new AI tools, you will soon. So that's definitely the first thing that comes to mind. and I love that Debra brought up about the AI soap notes that they're only as good as the person proofreading them.

but I think, so that's kind of the first nut to crack. The first kind of lowest hanging fruit as I like to say, is the soap notes. Because, you know, this goes back to what one of the things Dr. Wendy said about like, let me list all the things I don't like about practicing veterinary medicine. I think a lot of veterinarians would put paperwork as, as number one or number two on that list. I've seen a lot of these ads from the, the AI companies saying like, no one went to veterinary school because they love paperwork, or they love writing up their medical notes.

So I think that was the first kind of thing to fall, or the first one to go is the ai the ambient listening, which is like in a e has evolved past the dictation. you know, these dic, a lot of these dictation companies started out as like really radiologists and pathologists kind of dictating exactly what the, radiology report should say. It's, we've moved beyond that now where it's truly listening and summarizing what we're saying. And so it's, it's ambient listening, it's listening to the entire conversation.

And a lot of this also relates to what Deborah's saying about these conversations and when they are difficult conversations. But in terms of just step one, the soap notes, it's listening to the conversation between the veterinarian and the pet owner, the veterinary technician, the pet owner summarizing that information into a soap note format in the US if you're overseas into a history consult assessment plan format and making it super simple to just put that into your practice management software.

Again, super important that you actually proofread and interpret what it's saying, but can save you an incredible amount of time rather than sitting down at the end of your shift for the first time and starting writing up your notes for a case that you saw eight hours ago that you don't even remember the conversation that you had. I personally have done that. I know Dr. Wendy was saying earlier, like, she was like, I know Dr. Meszaros experience says I have experience at the end of an ER shift being like, oh my God, I do not know what I talked about 10 hours ago for this ear infection.

I don't even know if it was the right ear or the left ear. Let me try to interpret my chicken scratch on this piece of paper. so anyway, that's, I wanted to briefly talk about AI scribes, 'cause again, that's all the rage right now, but it is going to be pervasive and we've already started to see some of this throughout the software. So what do I mean by that? So Digit tail is really at the forefront of this. and I, I love some of the things they're posting.

They posted one recently where their AI is called Tails and they said, Hey, tails, please increase Dr. Johnson's production from 17 to 22% and it will actually go into their system and find her production value and increase it. And I think another place is gonna be reporting. You know, one of the things I hear so much about practice management software is I have to run five different reports to figure out the information I need and filter this report.

And, oh, I missed the days of immed, or I missed the days that I have marked where I could just run one clinic census and it told me everything I needed. I'm sure who's, who's, Ellen is gonna talk about some of this with the, the bookkeeping stuff later. Like people get so frustrated when they're like, I used to have this information right here in this one report and now I have to run three different reports in this stupid cloud-based system that my hospital made me switch to, or whatever. So I was chatting with a friend about this recently and I really think the future of reporting is gonna be more of a conversation with your software, which again is such a weird thing to think about, but it's kind of like the, those of us that are starting

to use these tools, these chat GPT tools, instead of necessarily Googling things, you know, Neren was talking about Googling everything. I, I'm less so than Googling everything. I'm starting to chat GPT some things now because it becomes a conversation. So you can ask your software, how many spas did I perform last month? How many of those spades did I do preoperative blood work on? How many of those spas did my estimate accurately match what my invoice was?

And it's actually going to be able to go into your data and figure these things out for you. So, you know, I hesitate to focus too much on ai 'cause I do think it's a buzzword and a fad and a trend. But at the same time, if I'm being honest, I do think it is the future. And the question, your question was, what do I believe is the future of veterinary software? I think it's gonna be AI completely throughout the software and also to the point where not only is it writing your soap note, it's listening to the conversation between you and the client.

It's writing your soap note, it's creating your treatment plan, it's creating your invoice, it maybe it's creating an estimate, creating a discharge all simultaneously that you can immediately hand it to the client. When we, when Deborah talks about things like client compliance, one of the things we know drives client compliance is every single client going home with whether or not in the future we, we use physical pieces of paper or not. I don't know, I still like physical pieces of paper sometimes, but not letting anyone leave the doors of your practice without something either in their hands or on their phone in their application explaining what we talked about today.

I can tell you how many practices I talked to where they're like, yeah, sometimes we do, sometimes we don't. Every single client should receive a summary of what we talked about today, what are next steps? because that's a, that's a huge hole right now in, in a lot of ways the practice use technology. My last thing I'll say in terms of the future of taking a, a beat away from the AI talk is consolidation of tools. So right now we have a lot of practices where we're using one program for our practice management system.

We're using a separate program for our client communication, you know, and maybe that includes like a pet portal, maybe not. Then, then, then there might be a separate program, which is like our CRM customer relationship management. Then there's a separate online pharmacy, then there's a separate online booking, then there's a separate digital treatment sheet. Some of them have it built in, some of them don't. again now, so now we're talking maybe four or five, six, especially some of these bigger practices, four or five, six different software platforms that, that the practice managers or the, the staff are having to manage simultaneously.

And we're already starting to see this with programs like Vet Suite, with covets rolling all of these things into one. And there's really a strong desire from clients, from my clients, which are veterinarians and practice managers to, I don't wanna have to learn four different programs and hopefully this program plays nice with this program. They just wanna do one that can do everything. and it's been slow going over the years. It's not moving as quickly as a lot of us would like, but it, they are trending in that direction.

Amazing, amazing, great perspective and thank you for highlighting how technology's evolving in the care, in the care delivery. So, now while technology is transforming the, the way we work, it's also opening up entirely new career paths for veterinarians outside of the traditional clinical route. So what advice would you give to veterinarians, curious about nonclinical career paths, particularly in tech or consulting? Yeah, I love, I love that you po you posed this question to me.

You, you've been following me online. I, I, I post about this quite a bit. I'm very passionate about it. I am one of those veterinarians that transitioned out of traditional clinical practice and into, and now I do mostly software consulting, that kind of thing. but I hear, I can't tell you how many people over the last few years have said, how, how do I do what you did? How do I make this type of transition? and first I do have to plug my group because one of the reasons I created the group was because I wasn't finding something doing this.

So I do have a group on LinkedIn called NCVC, nonclinical Veterinary Careers or Nonclinical Vet Med Careers. I changed the name because people were assuming it was only for veterinarians. And I said, no, it's for anybody. Technicians, veterinarians, practice managers, anybody that wants access to these resources. And the main page is just jobs. And I think a big barrier to entry here is like, people just don't even know what's out there. I hear so much, like, I don't, I just don't even know what the options are.

I don't even know what I would do. And, or, and, and that's the big thing is just to see who are the companies that are hiring in this space? What are they hiring for? What are the salary ranges? If they're posted? What is the job description? just to see what's out, what are the options? and then also networking. That's a separate page, but that's a, a big part of my spiel is people feel nervous to send a cold LinkedIn message or a cold email to say, well, they don't know me.

Is that weird? I, worst case scenario, they don't respond. I can't tell you how many amazing people I've met that have really truly helped me and helped me land jobs over the years purely from me sending just a random LinkedIn DM saying like, Hey, I would love to learn more about you and how you ended up where you ended up. and not necessarily like, because I want you to hire me, I just wanna learn more about what you do and how you got to that place.

I, I really do think a lot of people truly, and this is like a little cliche, but truly underestimate the power of networking and how helpful it can be. I've heard people, I've, I've applied to a hundred jobs mark, I don't know what to do. And I'm like, how much networking have you? How many people have you met? And just on a zoom call, just a zoom meet and greet. And they're like, none. I'm like, I do like two or three a week and I'm not looking for a job right now.

It's so valuable just to get to know the people in this space and maybe it might not come to fruition for six months later. That has happened to me where I had a conversation with someone when I was looking for a job and he said, mark, you're awesome. I I wanna get to know you more, but I can't hire you right now. And then six months later, that same person reached out to me and said, you're never gonna believe it. I need someone with exactly your qualifications.

And I, that was actually one of the, the best jobs I've had. so networking is huge. and then related to the job descriptions, people, a lot of time they're reading through these job descriptions and they say, I'm not qualified. And then they just skip right over apply to jobs that you're worried you're not qualified for. You never know what can happen. So, 'cause a lot of these jobs, so if you're, a lot of the people that are reaching out to me and looking and, and again, the, the way you know, the question was phrased and what I do is they have a lot of clinical experience.

They don't have a lot of non-clinical experience. So for instance, in my line of work, they're, they're applying for these software gigs and it says experience in this program or experience in that program. And they say, oh, I don't have experience in that program. I'm not even gonna apply. Do not undervalue your clinical experience. Like how attractive that is potentially to one of these companies that they can, that you can say, I had, I have 10 years of clinical experience just 'cause you don't have experience in this program or that program.

They might overlook that because of how much experience and knowledge you have just in veterinary medicine. And then going along with that, I'm really a huge fan of just being a super big go-getter, self motivator, self-starter. If one of those programs happens to have a free trial on the internet, download it. Do the free trial, teach yourself the basics. I've done this for interviews. And then in, in the interview process, if, you know, if you lay in the interview or, or if you're, you know, going back and forth with the recruiter, the hiring team, you can say, listen, honestly, no, I don't have experience in that program, but I downloaded it.

I did the free trial and I'm confident that I can get the hang of it pretty quickly. Or even, you know, even go that extra mile of like, if you do land the interview, do a screen share and show them, hey, I was playing around with this program and I was actually able to build a pretty basic wire frame of how I, what I think I might do with if you were to hire me in this program ways I think that your program could be improved. They love that. I don't know, I could go on and on, but yeah, little like tips and tricks.

I've, I've, picked up networking huge NCVC if, if it's helpful, join the group, apply for jobs you're afraid you're not qualified for, do some free trials of different programs and just be a super self-starter go-getter from day one.

Amazing. Amazing. before I move on to the next question, there is a question from San Sanjoy. Thank you for joining us Sanjoy. what are your pa particular recommendations in using AI technology? Record, patient veterinarian consultation.

Deborah will appreciate this. Number one, look up the laws in your state. figure out if you are a one party state or a two party state audio consent state, right? This makes a big difference if you and are a one party audio consent state. Now, I always recommend at least initially bringing it up with the client, having a conversation about, Hey, I have this new AI note taker. It's, you know, it helps me with my notes. Are you okay with us recording?

And nine, nine times outta 10? They're perfectly fine with it. You move on and everything's great. I actually have had the experience when I was implementing this across a half dozen hospitals and over a hundred veterinarians where they thought it was too cool, too interesting. And it was eating into our appointment time where they wanted to, oh my God, that is so cool. Tell me more. Tell me more, tell me more. And so we found, and that this company that I was working for happened to be in a one party state.

We found that it was like distracting sometimes. And so if you're in a one party state and you only need one party's consent, you know, it's still a good idea to throw a sign on the wall or put it in there like general consent to treat, but you don't necessarily have to bring it up in every single conversation. So just to be aware of that, if, that does become a pitfall. Now if you're in a two party state, you need consent, right? And so knowing what where you are is huge.

and maybe, and again, knowing is a sign on the wall enough, maybe it is, maybe it isn't. You really need to look at the legality behind it. the pre-PA them exactly. so that the veterinarian doesn't have to have that conversation. The front desk has that conversation, it's in their new client paperwork or whatever it might be. So that's my big thing in terms of just like getting started using these tools now in terms of like, what tool do I use? I, you know, look into.

'cause at the end of the day, you want these notes in your practice management system. And so what you don't wanna end up in a situation is you copy paste your history into history. You copy and paste your physical into physical copy and paste your assess. I'm getting tired of it and I'm not even halfway through and I'm just saying it rather than doing it. So if there are programs that have integrations available where your notes just automatically go where they're supposed to go, beautiful.

If not, is there a quick and easy way to that I can get these notes into this program? Have they figured out a way where I'm not having to manually copy paste things over? that gets into a little bit of a deeper kind of technical discussion. But think about that before you, just, pick, oh, I heard I've heard of scribe Noter, I've heard of Scribble Vet, or I've heard of Covet. I'm just gonna use it. Having no idea whether or not that program is a good fit for the practice management system that you're currently using.

That's definitely a pitfall that I've seen.

Amazing, amazing. perfect. Dr. Zaro, thank you for, thank you so much for sharing your expertise on technology and the future of veterinary medicine. It's clear that innovation when pair with the right mindset can truly shape a strong future for the, for the profession. It's been a pleasure having you with us in this discussion. And with that said, we are going into the next, segment. but before we move on to the next segment, there is a question I think, Dr.

Wendy Hauser would like to, answer this question. And that is how practice, how practicing animal welfare, yeah, animal welfare or pet welfare issues come into context for pet service practice. What would be your go-to strategy in this case? Yes. I wasn't sure to whom that question was addressed. So I'll give a quick response that may help to get to the heart of this. And then, any of the other panelists could jump in. I would say that financial triage is an incredibly important conversation to be having with clients these days.

It goes along with contextualized care, which I like that term better than spectrum of care and spectrum of care. Contextualized care are not new concepts. I graduated in the dark ages and we were taught how to do spectrum of care. So partnering with your clients, offering options, read Dr. Jason COE's many publications about this. He's at Guelph, and has a whole website dedicated to this through the university. and then there's look up the term financial triage.

How are you setting, I'm gonna even take a step back. Are you having conversations with your clients from day one about the expectations of what it costs to own a pet? And how are they gonna be prepared? Sadly, not if, but when they have an unexpected event happen with that pet that's gonna cost money. If you start having those conversations on day one, you're setting your clients up to have that consideration. You can then move into the financial triage conversation that talks about some different options and tools that you can have.

and then, I love and, and all transparency, I'm on their board of advisors, but I love my Balto, which is a 5 0 1 C3 for each hospital. You don't have to set it up. talk to Deb about how hard it is to set up 5 0 1 c threes. This is a company that does it for you and runs fundraising campaigns and has corporate sponsors that match your fundraising. So there's a lot of different ways to get around it. We do have to be sensitive to it, especially in this economic client climate.

I'm sorry, Lester, that was a little long and wordy. Anyone else wanna jump in?

Deborah, do you would like to, do you like to share anything? I just wanna reiterate the fact that transparency before they walk through the door and having that conversation that Wendy talked about throughout the life when they walk in with the puppy, gives them the idea of what they may need to expect, when they're getting a dog. no one ever checks the boxes on how much it's going to cost to have a dog. And then once they do, they get mad at the messenger, which is the veterinarian.

And quite frankly, you, you need to check that out before you get a dog. That doesn't mean you shouldn't get the dog, but you need to recognize that this is a conversation to have with your vets so that they know what you'd like to do, how you'd like to raise your pet, how you'd like to prepare. Like Noreen said, he got a dog that had certain issues that might come up when it got older and he worked with his vet to make sure they preppa the best life for this dog. Well, that's what clients need to do with their veterinarians maybe before they get the dog.

So maybe you won't get a French bulldog because it might have a lot of issues. You might get a terrier which has other issues, but you know, not as many. So you, you really need to have that conversation with the vet before you walk in with the puppy, which I think these, this entire panel will tell you doesn't often happen.

Thank you Deborah. So let's move into next Sigma with Andrea Crabtree. Andrea has worked, countless, countless veterinary practices on leadership and team development. And tonight we'll dive into some of the people for strategies that really make a difference in building resilient, thriving teams. So with that said, Andrea, recruiting and retaining re veterinary professionals is harder than ever. What people for strategies have proven most effective in your consulting work?

Thank you Lester for that question. I would definitely say that in my consulting work, I'm in a different practice every day and working with different teams, a lot of different teams. And I would say that recruiting and retaining veterinary professionals requires a different mindset, more of a people first mindset, and it goes beyond just pay and perks. And some of the most effective strategies focus on retention and creating a culture where team members feel valued and supported and have an ability to grow.

There's two approaches that I feel stand out the most to me. One is career mapping practices that define clear roles with growth. Growth opportunities and mentorship programs see much stronger retention. Team members want to know where they are, not just for today, but where they can be and what tomorrow looks like. And tomorrow can be short term, but also could tomorrow can be three to five years away. The other approach that stands out to me is safe to communication.

And I think one word that hopefully most of us have heard now is psychologically psychological safety. So safe communication, and that can be built through regular check-ins and structured feedback and conflict resilience, cultures build trust, and some of that vulnerability that Deborah was talking about builds that trust. And that's when team members feel safe and to be heard and they're also respected and those team members are far more likely to stay.

Amazing. Thank you for sharing that, Andrea. So, and of course now retention isn't just about keeping people, it's about supporting them in a meaningful way, especially when it comes to wellbeing. So you also, you're also a certified compassion fatigue professional. How should leaders recognize and address compassion fatigue before it impacts the whole team?

Well, compassion fatigue shows up really subtly and usually before it becomes a crisis, it can look like irritability or withdrawal. it can show up looking like a decrease in empathy. it can look like a, an increase in mistakes. And so sometimes it can be a little bit confusing to practice managers or even in leadership. Those are early warning signs that leadership should be kind of raising an eyebrow and looking out for. however, leaders we should also be looking for burnout in our team members.

Compassion, fatigue and burnout, can manifest in our employees very similarly in their symptoms, but they are two completely different things. and I think effective leaders

when they normalize conversations around mental health and wellbeing, rather than waiting for things like burnout to rear their ugly heads and growl like angry feral cats, they do better and are, practices are, more, make it more normalized to talk about these subjects. Addressing compassion fatigue and burnout early is key. And it isn't just a discussion to protect or even to support one particular individual. It's about creating that safe space, that psychologically safe environment and those safe conversations.

when we do things like have those healthy check-ins, it's modeling boundaries, which usually leadership is not very good at modeling those and providing resources. And a few examples of that would be, employee assistance programs or EAPs and offering support for client education around, or, I'm sorry, not client education. continuing education on resilience, strategies. And those help preserve the emotional health and resilience of the entire team instead of focusing on one particular individual.

So again, it's talking about that safe communication among the whole entire team.

That's such a practical way to look at it. Thank you, Andrea. And I think, you are highlighting how small steps can prevent, bigger challenges down the road when it comes to, burnout. So, let's zoom out a little and look at leadership practices, more broadly from your consulting work. And even through your podcast, you even seen a lot of what works and what doesn't. From your podcast and consulting, what's one leadership practice that veterinary managers should stop doing and, and one they should start?

So we ask this question to every single one of my guests I have on my show, the Positive Leadership Podcast. And from all the feedback that I hear from my guests, I think there's one that resonates the most. and, and it's, you know, that leadership practice manage managers really should stop avoiding the hard conversations. And Debra should know Debra over there nodding her head. Don't lean away from those, but actually lean into those, have those hard conversations and I think we avoid them in hopes that they go away and they resolve themself.

But silence usually fuels resentment and disengagement. And I feel like silence often works like an abscess. And we all know what happens with an abscess, right? Everybody eventually wants to watch what happens. They all flock to it and wants to see it rupture.

one, one, I guess thing practice managers and leaderships that they can, start doing and really lean into is giving timely and constructive feedback, framed specifically around curiosity and support. One thing I'm a big fan of is asking open-ended questions and getting curious, and Debra talked a lot about this. I think when we frame our questions, and our conversations always about, trying to see things through the other person's lens, it helps us get a better idea of what's going on through, through their insight.

And it helps us leaders support, and coach our teams much better. So if we can as leaders aje address challenges, directly and coach our team through those challenges and, and vulnerability, right? That's definitely what Debra was talking about. We can build trust and accountability and that's definitely lacking in a lot of practices that I see. Then we can have a healthier team culture. And that circles back to, what Dr. Wendy was talking about.

Thanks. Thank, that's, that's such a strong takeaway and, and anyone listening and I think they could basically implement this, right away, I mean, starting today. And thank you for putting it so clearly. And Andrea, thank you so much for sharing your insights and experience with us tonight. Your focus on People First. Leadership is such a powerful reminder that even in a technology driven era, rights, our teams and culture that ultimately drive long-term success.

It's a pleasure to have you with us. Thank you. So with that said, we are moving into a final segment of the evening and we are going to focus on how to master financial clarity.

So, so basically, financial clarity in a way that builds sustainability and reduce stress. To help us explore this, we are joined by Ellen Flowers, founder of EF Advising and keeping for veterinarians. Ellen has decades of experience guiding practices to achieve balance between profitability and wellbeing. She's here to share her insights with us tonight. So Ellen, many practices own many practice owners feel overwhelmed by finances. What's one system or habit they can adopt today to gain clarity and control?

Thank you, Ester. That's a great question. I think there's two different, actually aspects to this where the, you know, would be beneficial for them to gain both clarity and control. The first one really is, to begin with, every practice needs to have quality books. Meaning the person doing the bookkeeping is actually trained, has the knowledge of the veterinary field and keeps them accurate and up to date. And one of the biggest issues with veterinary hospitals, is that a lot of times they don't see bookkeeping scenes easy and a lot of people are self-taught.

so they might have an office manager doing it or a spouse or somebody else. and I was a really good example of this. I was self-taught and I did an okay job, but when I actually, you know, became certified and learned how to do it, I realized how much I didn't really understand, how much of a better job I could have done and how much time it would've saved me to be able to do other stuff, to have somebody that actually knew what they were doing. And part of the reason why I didn't do that was I was just so worried about, sharing my financials with somebody else.

I just wanted to keep it all myself and do it myself. So, you know, looking at me as an example, it's definitely a way better thing to outsource it to somebody else. 'cause sometimes it's hard to have like an office manager or something doing it, because they really have other things they could be spending their time on that would be a lot more valuable. the other thing that I think is really beneficial, is, and it's very simple and it's very, it is just developing a very powerful habit that a practice owner can adopt is dedicating one hour a month to reviewing their numbers, especially the cash flow.

a lot of people just look at the bank account, and they don't compare what came in, what goes out and how those numbers align with your forecasting. this gives the, a real picture of the, the health of the business. It helps you spot trends, prevents some issues from becoming larger problems. a lot of people, you know, they look at the books and say, well, why don't I have any money in my bank account? Or they're looking at the profit loss and say, well, it says I made this much money but it's not in my bank account.

And what they're not realizing is that there's a lot of stuff on the, balance sheet that's not on the profit loss. So they're not seeing the loans that they're spending the principal, and they're not seeing a lot of other things. So you really have to look at a cash flow statement. So without those, that whole complete picture, you really, they're not understanding. So if they do that, just like, and veterinarians practice owners do not like looking at numbers, but it's really important for them to do that.

And it helps, you know, to have somebody that can kind of break it down for them and give 'em a simplified picture. So it's not taking them a lot of time to try to like, you know, duck Mark was saying as far as like having so many different reports in all different areas and what, how do you find the information that you really want simply without spending hours and hours.

Exactly. That's, that's such a practical starting point. Sometimes it's a simple and consistent habits that makes a difference in creating confidence around finances. But now we do have a question from Joy. Again. Again, thank you. Thank you Joy for both this question. How do you code taxes that are charged on invoices from vendors when there's a mix of taxable and non-taxable items?

When, how do you quote, lemme look at the, is it in the chat? Yeah, it's in the chat. How do you code taxes? Lemme just How do you code taxes that are charging

taxable, taxable medications?

I mean, typically your computer software has a pretty well set up so that when you're putting it in there, it should be coming up automatically. I, I did not wanna jump in, but yes. Yeah, yeah. I mean, most software should have it in there. More a question directly for the pins that you're using. Sorry Ellen, I don't wanna steal your No, That's good. I was like, oh My, I think it's kind of like, but point I would, whatever practice management software you're using, I'm sure there is a way to do this.

And it might be a question of like, working with their support team to make sure that you have things set up correctly on the backend. but this, I've never worked with any practice management software that, had that is not capable of doing this. Not sales to customers. This is invoices from vendors. Okay, nevermind. You're back on Ellen. Okay. That makes it's a little different. pretty much a lot of times it, it doesn't really make a big difference as far as the big picture 'cause it's pretty minute.

and the vendors, again, usually when you set it up with the vendors when you are getting it, you know, it's, it's, it's usually a line item at the bottom of the end. so we don't really get too particular about it when we're doing the bookkeeping. we'll break down, like we'll have expense accounts where we will have, the information come from the pmi p the, the process management for the veterinaries as far as revenue and cost of goods. Goods. And we'll put that into QuickBooks with a, a journal entry.

But, we don't break it down to that, that minute of detail.

If I can interject, one simple old school way I did it when I was a hospital owner was I had two different accounts. I had one for taxable and one that was non-taxable because I did have to pay state sales tax on all taxable items. Now, that was prior to the automatic coding by VMG. I mean, back in the day I had to do all of the coding myself, but that was a very simple way to handle it. So I, I'm not sure

The inventory, software has that in. So when you put in the product, the one time there was an, pro an issue was like Valium, when you have it in-house, and you pay use tax on it. I actually got set audited for, sales tax and I got tagged because sometimes you sell it to a client to use, so that should have been charged differently. So there's a little bit of a discrepancy from that, and that's both kind of in-house and sales to the client.

Hopefully that helped.

So, let's go a bit deeper into the balance side of things. So how do you help veterinarians balance financial sustainability, with their desire to focus on patient care?

Again, most veterinarians that I work with, they don't, they wanna be in the exam rooms or in the surgery rooms, you know, helping pets not stuck behind a computer, trying to figure out what the numbers all mean. so I have a process that I use, it's like a seven step process, that allows the practice owner to kind of see the whole picture of their business. So it's just kinda looking at the, historical numbers and then putting it into, you know, budgeting and forecasting and then kind of like having, a breakdown of like set goals that they have and where we are currently and then where we're forecasted for the year.

And then with that information we can go ahead and look at the whole picture and say, make, you know, decisions on how we wanna grow their practice, what would be the best, most, beneficial way of doing that. So then every month we sit down and we have different steps that we come up with that are, you know, the best step for them at that time. and then we work also to, determine what on the veterinarian schedule can be delegated to other people. 'cause a lot of times they just spend too much time doing stuff that somebody else showed ought to be doing.

and then when they understand the whole financial side of the business is under control, then it gives them kind of more peace of mind and then they can focus on the patient care.

Excellent. Excellent. Now for the final question in the segment, I want to bring into your unique vantage point as both a former practice owner and now an advisor. as a former practice owner yourself, what mistakes do you often see practices making in the financial management? How can they avoid them?

So that's a great question, of course. there's a lot of different things that obviously people can be doing. One that we just touched on was delegation. trying to do everything yourself and not being necessarily trained or the best person to do that. determining everything and anything that you can delegate and training someone and bringing them up to do it so you're confident in their ability to do it and, and, and giving them, you know, the, the confidence to do it.

So I think that's huge and it takes a lot of time off of your, your, your plate and gives you time and it allows them to feel more, rewarded for their job that they can do. another mistake is waiting until tax season to get organized, which leads to stress and missed opportunities and sometimes some costly surprises. and I guess, you know, meeting, having a, a good time, a tax professional that you can, you know, plan ahead of time with and know what's going on. And then again, having the accurate and UpToDate bookkeeping is huge.

If you don't have good numbers, you don't know where you are and, and how you're doing. back to reviewing your financial reports regularly, people don't like to do it, but it's huge. You have to, you really need to do that to know how you're doing. and then focusing again on the cash flow and not just the profit loss or the balance sheet, you know, and then looking at your key, performance indicators so you know how you're comparatively doing previously and to other comparable clinics so that you kind of know where you should be and where you're at and, and where you, need to be.

And then having a financial partner who understands veterinary practices specifically that can help the owners, you know, stay proactive rather than reactive is huge.

Excellent, excellent. Such an important reminder, like learning from those common pitfalls can save practices years of, stress and lost opportunity. So Ellen, thank you for wrapping up, tonight's discussion with such clear actionable advice. Finances can often feel intimidating, but you've shown us with the right systems and mindset practices can actually thrive while stay staying true into their values. It's been a pleasure having you share your expertise with us.

So as we wrap up tonight,

if you do have any questions, please, feel free to add in the chat or in the q and a, and, you should be able to basically move into the discussion. but as we wrap up tonight, I just want to take, I was just want to give you a quick reminder actually, if you haven't yet, booked your complimentary marketing strategy meeting, which was also, spoken before, with Raja. So this is your chance to do it. So you'll see the QR code on your screen, just scan it, or check the link in the chat to reserve your spot.

It's free personalize, it's a great opportunity to get tailored insights for your practice. Again, you might not, you might learn something new, again, which you not didn't know about your, the, your digital marketing when it comes to, your online visibility. So when things like this come, you might have the question, you know, what's the risk of me booking this meeting? Well, it's just your time and what's the risk of you not booking this meeting?

Again, it's just going to be a missed opportunity. So I'm just gonna leave it you with that. again, this is all complimentary, no strings attached. and I'm, I'm going to make sure that it's gonna be a well spent time for you. So with that said, if you haven't taken advantage, of this, please go ahead and I encourage you to, so before you head out, so our time has, come to an end. but before I do, so, I just wanna check if you have any questions.

all right. So yeah, so we are right on time. Our time has come to an end and actually the time is flying tonight. So much of comprehensive answers, valuable takeaways, and it has been awesome. First of all, thank you to our expert panelists, Dr. Wendy Hauser and Raja, Deb Hamilton, Dr. Mark Massaro, Andrea Crabtree and Alan Flowers. You all were amazing. So much insight, best practices, actionable content, and very tangible fa passion for what you do and how you do it, and who you are and why you matter.

If I were to sum it up, I'd say collectively, you made the complex, simple, the hidden, visible, and the difficulty easy. Secondly, thank you to all, to all of our attendees for the privilege of your time and participation. Without you, we don't grow together without you. We don't set each other for success. A reminder to like, and share and review us on your favorite social media. Stay connected with our panelists if you like, a deeper conversation like this.

So until next time, and on behalf of our panelists, thank you and keep striving for excellence and making a positive impact in the lives of your patients and your pet parents. Thank you again for being with us tonight. We'll see you at the next Veterinary Business Summit. Until then, take care. Bye.